Confidence AND Humility

Jaclyn: 00:00:00

Hello, you're listening to the Faith and Family Filmmakers podcast.

Jaclyn: 00:00:03

My name is Jaclyn, and today I have Aaron Fullen with me.

Jaclyn: 00:00:07

And in the last episode, um, we were getting to know Aaron and his journey pursuing both acting and film scoring.

Jaclyn: 00:00:16

And, he also shared a story about having to make a very difficult decision and.

Jaclyn: 00:00:21

It's such a relatable story.

Jaclyn: 00:00:23

If you didn't get to hear it, I encourage you to go back and listen, but I know it's relatable because I've been there as well.

Jaclyn: 00:00:28

I had this exciting opportunity.

Jaclyn: 00:00:30

There was a project that was actually commissioned by the King of Jordan, and I worked on four episodes, but as those episodes were going, like I was doing, uh, some script stuff, um, but as those episodes were coming to me for me to, to edit and uh, I just realized like.

Jaclyn: 00:00:50

This is going in a direction that is, uh, worrying me.

Jaclyn: 00:00:54

And so I spoke with the writers, um, and I told them, I said, look, you could correct this if you brought in this other detail.

Jaclyn: 00:01:03

'cause the thing is, this story was incredibly one-sided.

Jaclyn: 00:01:06

And in doing so, when you create an a one-sided story, you end up alienating the other side or painting them in a very, um.

Jaclyn: 00:01:17

Bad light.

Jaclyn: 00:01:18

And in this case, that was the case.

Jaclyn: 00:01:20

It it painted them in a light that would make you wanna hate them.

Jaclyn: 00:01:23

And so I had to explain to them like, I can't be part of this.

Jaclyn: 00:01:27

If this is the direction, if you fix it by doing those things or these things that I was suggesting, um, then it would balance out the story and I could continue.

Jaclyn: 00:01:36

But otherwise I will have to say that I'm not going to continue.

Jaclyn: 00:01:40

And so then I didn't hear from them again.

Jaclyn: 00:01:42

So.

Jaclyn: 00:01:44

Uh, yeah, on the one hand it was, I was disappointed because like, this was really an exciting opportunity and it would give me like international credits, which I guess I did get them anyways, but I really wanted to, to be part of this project.

Jaclyn: 00:02:00

But if they weren't going to give a, a full picture or at least share their story in a way that would allow for some balance, I guess, then.

Jaclyn: 00:02:11

I just, I couldn't do it because this is the thing, and I tell people, even for, uh, faith-based films as well, like, you can't paint non-believers as the enemy in general, like you, you need to balance that out and recognize humans are humans and you know, some are good, some are evil, and it doesn't necessarily.

Jaclyn: 00:02:31

Mean, like your side is the only side with good people, and the other side is the only side with evil people.

Jaclyn: 00:02:36

Right.

Jaclyn: 00:02:36

You just can't do that.

Jaclyn: 00:02:37

That falls into the category of propaganda.

Jaclyn: 00:02:40

And so, uh, I was like, I'm, my hands are off.

Jaclyn: 00:02:43

I'm not doing this.

Jaclyn: 00:02:44

Uh, but it was, it was difficult like, you know, with your story too.

Jaclyn: 00:02:47

So, so yeah.

Jaclyn: 00:02:49

I mean, I think in this industry, especially when we're here to serve God, there's going to be some times where we have to make tough choices.

Aaron: 00:02:56

Yes.

Aaron: 00:02:57

And you know what's great is that God can redeem those decisions in ways that you, uh.

Aaron: 00:03:02

I can't imagine.

Aaron: 00:03:03

And even the relationships, uh, I think that was, there's a gracious way to back out of a project, and even though I felt like I was floundering a bit, when I did that, turns out that fun part of the story.

Aaron: 00:03:19

I worked with the executive from the studio probably three or four years ago, randomly out of the, I hadn't been in touch with him for years, and he reached out.

Aaron: 00:03:32

On LinkedIn and pitched a project to me and basically I responded with some surprise and just said, I'm, I'm so honored you reached out for me to ever work with you again.

Aaron: 00:03:45

And the project was actually doing arrangements of Christmas carols and because he knew I'd probably want to do something like that.

Jaclyn: 00:03:55

Yeah, exactly.

Jaclyn: 00:03:56

That's up your alley.

Aaron: 00:03:58

Yeah.

Aaron: 00:03:58

So he said, I'm gonna be honest with you, I've, wanted to work with you ever since that went down and I was floored.

Aaron: 00:04:07

But that's just goes to show you number one, that people admire when you stand up for what you believe in, even if they don't necessarily agree with your, decision.

Aaron: 00:04:16

And that if you do it well and you do it in a God honoring way, you don't know what could come of those things down the road.

Aaron: 00:04:23

Um, so just.

Aaron: 00:04:24

Do it well.

Aaron: 00:04:24

If you have to end a working relationship, do it with Grace and try to keep those relationships intact if at all possible.

Jaclyn: 00:04:33

Yeah, definitely.

Jaclyn: 00:04:34

I, I like when you were saying before about you know, just you can pursue that conversation with Grace.

Jaclyn: 00:04:41

And I've heard that from a lot of people actually.

Jaclyn: 00:04:43

And especially the people that I've heard it from are people that have been able to accomplish a lot.

Jaclyn: 00:04:49

And so that's great advice.

Jaclyn: 00:04:51

'cause you know, if somebody has accomplished a lot in the film industry, that means they've.

Jaclyn: 00:04:54

Already gone through a lot of nos.

Jaclyn: 00:04:56

You know,

Aaron: 00:04:57

Yes.

Aaron: 00:04:58

Safe

Jaclyn: 00:04:58

lot of things that they've dealt with a lot of rejection.

Jaclyn: 00:05:01

Like there's a lot that they've dealt with in order to get where they are at the moment.

Jaclyn: 00:05:05

So, um, so let's actually talk about your, I mean, we talked about your acting and your composing and you know, how you were thinking to, to pursue one.

Jaclyn: 00:05:17

Over the other, but then you know, you realize actually you're gonna pursue both.

Jaclyn: 00:05:21

And recently you ended up pursuing both on the same project.

Jaclyn: 00:05:27

Tell us about that.

Aaron: 00:05:28

So that.

Aaron: 00:05:29

Is, it's been an interesting journey because as it often does, one seems to be doing better than the other side of my career, and then it flip flops.

Aaron: 00:05:42

And so I have to ride each wave, whatever's presenting itself at the time, uh, which is fun and exciting, but sometimes you want a little more, uh, stability in both.

Jaclyn: 00:05:54

Stability.

Aaron: 00:05:57

I can't believe I said that word.

Aaron: 00:06:00

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 00:06:01

of all, you're in the film industry.

Jaclyn: 00:06:02

Second of all, you're a Christian.

Jaclyn: 00:06:04

Like God doesn't necessarily wanna walk us through stability.

Jaclyn: 00:06:09

I.

Aaron: 00:06:10

Yes.

Aaron: 00:06:10

Poor choice of words.

Aaron: 00:06:12

Um, so I've had people come alongside me.

Aaron: 00:06:16

In fact, I remember a call I've received, from someone very well-meaning, and I, I say that.

Aaron: 00:06:23

With full confidence, they were well-meaning, but strongly encouraged me.

Aaron: 00:06:28

Pick one.

Aaron: 00:06:29

And basically, since you're not gonna, you can't be successful in one or one, um, if you're busy trying to get established in the other.

Aaron: 00:06:42

And so I listened and gave it a lot of thought.

Aaron: 00:06:46

But I just don't think in my brain, again, artist brain, I was thinking to myself, well, that doesn't apply to anything really else in life.

Aaron: 00:06:56

You're not called to just be, I'm not just called to be a husband.

Aaron: 00:07:00

I. When I have children, I have to be a father too.

Aaron: 00:07:02

I'm not called just to be a father.

Aaron: 00:07:03

I have to be a, a, a friend.

Aaron: 00:07:05

I have to serve those around me.

Aaron: 00:07:08

We're all called to and, and do a job for crying out loud.

Aaron: 00:07:11

that's, you have to balance and excel.

Aaron: 00:07:15

We're called to excellence in those separate roles.

Aaron: 00:07:19

So to me, as I was thinking through it, if I feel the Lord has equipped me to do both of these in tandem, then.

Aaron: 00:07:27

I think I should keep that door open.

Aaron: 00:07:30

And so I did.

Aaron: 00:07:31

And not long after that, the opportunity you just mentioned came along and to me it felt very affirming from the Lord to bless me with that.

Aaron: 00:07:40

And it was the first feature film, it was a, a musical feature film called Carol, directed by George A. Johnson, probably many of you know who, uh, he is.

Aaron: 00:07:52

And it was written by James two, uh, originally as a stage play.

Aaron: 00:07:57

For his church.

Aaron: 00:07:58

Church.

Aaron: 00:07:58

And then they adapted it into, uh, a Christmas movie and lots of musical numbers.

Aaron: 00:08:03

So, uh, I was the, I was originally brought on as the orchestrator for the songs that James, and another fellow named Aaron had written.

Aaron: 00:08:13

And so I did all of those.

Aaron: 00:08:14

And then they, during that process, they were like, you act too, huh?

Aaron: 00:08:18

Well, we love to see you audition for the lead role, Solomon Lynch.

Aaron: 00:08:22

And so.

Aaron: 00:08:24

Did that ended up landing the role.

Aaron: 00:08:27

And so that was my first experience taking a lead in a feature film.

Aaron: 00:08:32

Very nerve racking.

Aaron: 00:08:33

But again, one of those experiences that I got through it, I'm like, okay, I can do it.

Aaron: 00:08:40

I can actually do this.

Aaron: 00:08:42

And then I composed the original score after.

Aaron: 00:08:46

So I got to see it from the very early stages through I. You know, music's one of the very last things that happens in a film.

Aaron: 00:08:54

So that was a thrill just released, uh, last month.

Aaron: 00:08:58

And again, i, I, think it's so important to have those projects that you finish and it's a gift from God for him to show you that piece of work and for you to, you know, you're not always happy with every little part of whatever you wrote or your performance or whatever.

Aaron: 00:09:18

If you can walk away from it more motivated and confident that, you know what I think this is what God wants for me.

Aaron: 00:09:27

That's so helpful to have, you know, there's, there's plenty of times when people go their whole career just not sure, and when you don't have a confidence - in any career, but especially in the film industry- if you don't have any essence of confidence that you're doing what God has before you, it's so easy to just be all over the place mentally.

Aaron: 00:09:52

we all go there at

Jaclyn: 00:09:54

Right.

Aaron: 00:09:55

oh my word.

Aaron: 00:09:55

I'm not talented.

Aaron: 00:09:56

I have no skills.

Aaron: 00:09:57

This I meant I absolute de

Aaron: 00:09:58

delusional

Jaclyn: 00:09:59

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 00:10:00

what am I doing?

Jaclyn: 00:10:01

Who am I kidding?

Aaron: 00:10:02

that's natural.

Aaron: 00:10:03

But we do all need those moments of, okay.

Aaron: 00:10:07

Whether it be affirmation from people we look up to or people who are in the industry, like, listen for those things and, and remember those things in those dark times when you're, when you feel like a failure and you know your confidence as a is at an all time low and hear me out.

Aaron: 00:10:26

Confidence much different than pride.

Aaron: 00:10:30

our pride should not be there because everything you've been given.

Aaron: 00:10:35

Your career, uh, whatever your, your filmmaking career is, is a gift from the creator we create because he created us to create.

Aaron: 00:10:44

So having always keep that in mind, someone asks, how do you do what you do?

Aaron: 00:10:48

Well, the creator of the universe gave me this gift.

Aaron: 00:10:51

That's, I mean, there you have it and a lot of hard work, but being quick to attribute the glory to him.

Aaron: 00:11:00

that should give us a confidence that is not rooted in.

Aaron: 00:11:03

Anything but knowing that God has me here for a very specific purpose and I can therefore move forward with confidence.

Aaron: 00:11:11

So

Jaclyn: 00:11:12

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 00:11:12

Yeah, definitely.

Jaclyn: 00:11:13

There've been a, few, um, interviews that we've had on this podcast where people have said, and I quickly came to the realization, I'm not that big of a deal.

Jaclyn: 00:11:22

Um, and they're very successful people.

Jaclyn: 00:11:25

And so, you know, to hear people that have accomplished a lot, recognize I'm not that big of a deal, then you start to understand how you navigate that mindset of like.

Jaclyn: 00:11:35

Yes, I'm capable at this job and I'm good at it, and you know, I have this capacity, but the world is spinning whether I'm here or not.

Aaron: 00:11:44

Yes.

Aaron: 00:11:45

Yep.

Aaron: 00:11:46

The constant drive to be the best.

Aaron: 00:11:49

There's a healthy part of that, you know, that keeps you pushing.

Aaron: 00:11:53

But there's also something really wonderful about remembering that there will always be someone better than you at something.

Aaron: 00:12:00

And so that helps with those crippling like, oh, I have to be the best if you can know.

Aaron: 00:12:07

Well, no, that's how.

Aaron: 00:12:09

For example, in sports, people beat records.

Aaron: 00:12:12

People become the best.

Aaron: 00:12:13

You know, nothing stays stagnant.

Aaron: 00:12:15

And that's a beautiful thing, really, that people are constantly aiming for bigger and better and achieving, you know, great things.

Aaron: 00:12:23

But knowing that puts you at ease and allows you to focus on your little niche, like what are, what are you bringing that you know the people.

Aaron: 00:12:33

Around you maybe necessarily aren't bringing, you don't write the same type of music as John Williams.

Aaron: 00:12:38

That's okay.

Aaron: 00:12:39

What?

Aaron: 00:12:39

What do you write really well and do that really, really well and focus on those things.

Aaron: 00:12:44

It can really help focus our direction.

Jaclyn: 00:12:47

Absolutely it, it reminds me of the parable of the talents.

Jaclyn: 00:12:51

You know, like if you've been given five talents, then you need to invest five talents.

Jaclyn: 00:12:55

If you've been given two, then you need to invest.

Jaclyn: 00:12:57

Two, you are not expected to invest.

Jaclyn: 00:12:59

Five, you don't have it.

Jaclyn: 00:13:01

So it's like you don't have to be the best, but you have to be your best.

Jaclyn: 00:13:06

And sometimes being your best means.

Jaclyn: 00:13:08

Being the best and making, like hitting that record and all of that.

Jaclyn: 00:13:12

But, but that's not necessarily the goal.

Jaclyn: 00:13:15

It's being your best and bringing the excellence that you can bring, which is continually growing.

Jaclyn: 00:13:22

That's, I think, what the goal needs

Aaron: 00:13:24

Amen.

Aaron: 00:13:25

And I love that proverb.

Aaron: 00:13:26

Do you see a man who excels in his work?

Aaron: 00:13:28

He will stand before Kings.

Aaron: 00:13:30

That idea of whatever your work is, it doesn't specify what the work is or whether you're the best or not.

Aaron: 00:13:37

It just says you, you excel at, at the work that you do.

Aaron: 00:13:41

You will stand before kings, not before obscure men.

Jaclyn: 00:13:45

Yes.

Jaclyn: 00:13:45

And work ethic, as you had mentioned before, like it plays such a huge role into it and I, I mean, work ethic is something that gets people's attention.

Jaclyn: 00:13:54

So I wanna ask you, where do you see God moving in your corner of the industry?

Aaron: 00:14:00

I have a really cool story that just happened a month or two ago, just seeing how the Lord.

Aaron: 00:14:07

Even uses situations in unintended results of circumstances.

Aaron: 00:14:12

And I was trying to establish contact, I was trying to connect with Candace Cameron Beret a few months ago, and I. Anybody who watches stuff that I do, I'm, I just try.

Aaron: 00:14:24

I sh I, I

Aaron: 00:14:25

sh

Jaclyn: 00:14:26

it.

Jaclyn: 00:14:27

I reposted it for you.

Jaclyn: 00:14:29

Not that I'm any closer.

Aaron: 00:14:30

that.

Aaron: 00:14:31

Um, so I, I try to just reach out in a winsome way and get people's attention, and sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Aaron: 00:14:39

But it's, it's just me.

Aaron: 00:14:41

it is the way that I do it.

Aaron: 00:14:43

And that has.

Aaron: 00:14:44

Um, unexpectedly worked sometimes, and so I was really hoping to, to connect with her and wasn't hearing from her.

Aaron: 00:14:53

But through that video, a composer reached out to me, uh, an Emmy nominated composer, and basically said, well, number one, he wanted to set up a time to, to meet with me via Zoom.

Aaron: 00:15:06

And, then he just said, I became a Christian.

Aaron: 00:15:11

I. Recently, a few years ago in the midst of my career and have been wanting to make some significant changes in how I'm navigating my career.

Aaron: 00:15:23

And I've greatly appreciated the way that you have.

Aaron: 00:15:26

And so I would love to talk to you and hear from you and let's get to know each other.

Aaron: 00:15:33

And we did, and we've been in touch since.

Aaron: 00:15:36

And hearing his testimony, uh, has been.

Aaron: 00:15:39

So encouraging to me and to see, you know, he has great talent, but he's just, he feels burdened about what his role is in how he's actually in LA and working there as an assistant for a big time composer, but also composing on his own.

Aaron: 00:15:57

And so it made me realize.

Aaron: 00:15:59

Number one, God is working in people in this industry.

Aaron: 00:16:03

And like you said with the show you were on, I think sometimes it's so easy to view Hollywood as Sodom and Gomorrah and some people kind of do have that perspective of that.

Aaron: 00:16:15

It's just the absolute pip and we should all stay as far away from it as possible.

Aaron: 00:16:22

And that is simply.

Aaron: 00:16:23

The wrong attitude, the wrong perspective to have, and I think that has been probably one of the most detrimental.

Aaron: 00:16:30

I, I've talked to other filmmakers and artists who were even raised in household, and this isn't just our present generation for generations.

Aaron: 00:16:38

It's been artists and theater, and all of those are of the devil.

Aaron: 00:16:44

When in reality, art is and always has been.

Aaron: 00:16:48

The Lords.

Aaron: 00:16:49

And so he's the author of it.

Aaron: 00:16:50

We've just lost touch with it, and anything can be used for good or evil.

Aaron: 00:16:56

And so that mindset is so destructive and God is working in the industry and I was so encouraged to hear this young man who was surrounded by people, people that came around him and invited him to a Bible study and, and showed him the light of Christ.

Aaron: 00:17:12

And now he's making.

Aaron: 00:17:15

Big life decisions based on that new relationship that he has with Christ and who knows what the impact that one conversion will be and what he will accomplish in the industry.

Aaron: 00:17:28

And so viewing that world, so to speak, rightly, I think is so important.

Aaron: 00:17:33

And second thing that you don't know what kind of impact your.

Aaron: 00:17:41

Testimony will have on the world around you.

Aaron: 00:17:44

Not everyone's on social media.

Aaron: 00:17:45

I realize when you're on social media, people can see it more, but I'm just talking In your community, in your family, in your circle of friends, the way you live your life, it's the way God designed it.

Aaron: 00:17:56

He made you for a reason, for such a time, is this to impact those around you in some way, shape, or form?

Aaron: 00:18:05

And so sometimes we're going one direction and he.

Aaron: 00:18:09

Uses the way we're going to bring someone into our lives or bring about a circumstance that we weren't expecting that benefits you and benefits those around you in unexpected ways.

Aaron: 00:18:24

And so be looking for those things.

Aaron: 00:18:26

That's the other thing I would encourage be open to the fact that maybe my main goal that I'm shooting for, it's gonna adjust over time and that's okay because if you're trusting your ways.

Aaron: 00:18:37

Acknowledging him in all your ways, he'll make your paths straight and in the direction he wants that path to go.

Jaclyn: 00:18:45

And also like another thing I'm, I'm hearing in the middle of that is that it's not just the product at the end that we're serving God with.

Jaclyn: 00:18:54

It's the process along the way that we're serving God with.

Jaclyn: 00:18:58

So it's not just, oh, I want this movie to go out and touch people's hearts.

Jaclyn: 00:19:01

It's like.

Jaclyn: 00:19:02

Everybody that you touch in the process of making the movie, you wanna touch people's hearts.

Aaron: 00:19:07

Yeah.

Aaron: 00:19:07

To, to me, who's involved in the film and the whole process of being on a set, talk about an opportunity to be the light of Christ.

Aaron: 00:19:17

I mean, it's a high stress environment.

Aaron: 00:19:19

A lot of times people are just a little frazzled, and you can come onto a set and mitigate against that, just by shining with the light of Christ.

Jaclyn: 00:19:31

Amen.

Jaclyn: 00:19:32

Well, that sounds like a, a perfect place to close and let God have that final thought.

Jaclyn: 00:19:38

Thank you so much for being on our podcast.

Jaclyn: 00:19:40

I've really enjoyed this.

Jaclyn: 00:19:41

We've had some laughs and some serious conversation and it's been fantastic.

Jaclyn: 00:19:46

I really appreciate getting to know you and I'm looking forward to hopefully working.

Jaclyn: 00:19:50

With you on something in the future.

Aaron: 00:19:52

Yes.

Aaron: 00:19:52

Uh, this has been awesome, Jaclyn, and just a quick shout out to you, for those of you who aren't aware of, you know, Jacqueline's writing abilities and, and connecting Jacqueline's, a, a fantastic connector of people and just some of the table read I've done with her have been.

Aaron: 00:20:11

Such enriching experiences, not just the stories that she.

Aaron: 00:20:15

Helps tell, but everyone she brings together and the culture that you have cultivated on those table reads just makes me want to be on all of them.

Aaron: 00:20:27

It's just such a, a beautiful thing and the way that you try to help connect and, promote others in such a, a wonderful way.

Aaron: 00:20:35

it's great.

Aaron: 00:20:35

So if you don't know Jaclyn better than you do right now, reach out and connect.

Jaclyn: 00:20:43

If you don't know all the things.

Jaclyn: 00:20:44

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 00:20:46

All right.

Jaclyn: 00:20:46

Well thank you for that shout out.

Jaclyn: 00:20:48

I appreciate it and I've enjoyed having you in the table reads as well.

Aaron: 00:20:51

It's been great and thanks for the interview.

Jaclyn: 00:20:53

God bless.